I do not know whether the seal ‘on its own’ is justified in this case with two points and nine goals behind the league leaders with 12 days left. I am aware that you are of course referring to the direct duel between Leipzig and Bayern, in which the Leipzigers can grab first place. But ‘on your own’ sounds to me more like you’ve already got a head start on something and can only gamble away it yourself, no matter what your competitors are up to.
The re is still almost 1/3 of the season to play and the rest of the Bundesliga program – if you can even call it that with so many games – is still relatively balanced. At the moment Bayern are admittedly in a weak form, the momentum speaks more for the Leipzig. In the DFB Cup, Bayern can plan important regeneration time, while the omens in the CL speak against the Leipzigers. Both clubs have about the same bad luck with injuries.
Let’s agree that the championship will be decided on the ‘Showdown on Matchday 27’
“On your own” is a purely theoretical-technical term that means exactly what it says, namely: Whether someone can still become a master on his own (without the help of others). Actually uncommon in football, but more in other sports: In Formula 1, people often talk about whether someone can still become world champion “on their own” (so can I still be a World Cup if I always win and the other person always comes in second?) as well as whether someone in the NBA or NFL makes it into the playoffs.
“By your own strength” is always referred to a team / athlete behind – someone who is already in the lead can ALWAYS become a master on their own.
Yes and no – If someone in 15th place goes into the season finale with a point ahead of 16th place, then people like to say that the said team can make it clear that they are not relegated “on their own”. It is more seldom that you refer to the previous opponent, because he can not only achieve success on his own, no, he also needs the corresponding, weaker performance of the better placed opponent. As you say, usually only one team can become master “under its own steam”, namely that which defends its place in the sun – everyone else needs the help of the other team, because at least this one step is still to be taken.
Aside from this conceptual-technical slaughter, it’s exciting again for once. I’m honest, out of antipathy I indulge. the Leipzigers rather the Bavarians the title, but it shows that the work in Saxony is bearing fruit. Leipzig is there when Bayern are weak and forces them to fight for the top of the table, which has happened too rarely in recent years to cause Bayern real problems in the championship.
No, not. When it is said in the relegation battle that someone can stay up “on their own”, it means that they can ONLY stay up on their own. Example: Schalke are two points behind Cologne on the penultimate place in the table before the last matchday. On the last day there will be a duel with Schalke: Cologne – Schalke can still make it through their own efforts to stay in the league or make it into the relegation. If Schalke is two points behind Bielefeld, however, the Bielefeld team will have it in their own hands in the parallel game and Schalke CANNOT make it on their own.
Another example: 2001 season finale: Before the penultimate matchday, Bayern could no longer become champions on their own. But Schalke loses and is now behind Bayern. Now Schalke can no longer become champions on their own. Bayern made a point and managed to win the championship on the last day of the match “on their own” – but on the penultimate game day with the help of Schalke and therefore not on their own.
And that contradicts my contribution now where? If Schalke is not two points behind but two points ahead of Cologne in the example you first created, then Schalke still has it in their own hands and this is also communicated in the media.
Up to five teams are threatened with relegation from the district league – but FC Lindenberg is in control of staying up. Due to the important 3: 2 in the catch-up game against Brochenzell, the promoted team jumped to a non-relegation place and – with six games left – has at least two points ahead of the relegation place.
Dortmund. In the long-distance duel against SG Finnentrop / Bamenohl, Westfalia from Wickede has significantly better cards. A draw against SpVg Olpe is definitely enough for her to defend the three-point lead. But coach Marko Schott had already announced that he would play to win.
“We are happy and grateful to have it in our own hands. Or as Thomas Tuchel would say: We are going into the game with all perseverance and humility.”
Soccer regional league Bremen
Relegation now in their own hands
Olaf Schnell 05/19/2019 0 comments
The “Hussars” put this into practice after the 2-1 first leg success (8: 1).
“First of all, the three points were important for us. We didn’t know how many people Lesum was playing with. We had the right attitude from the start. It is important for us that we have it in our own hands in the relegation battle against Lemwerder, ”said Grohn’s striker Elvan Öksel.
As eleventh in the table last year, SG Rommerz was not expected to do much this year either. For some, the club was even among the relegation candidates of the A-League Fulda before the season. After 24 games, the situation looks completely different: Ingo Jökel’s squad now has the championship in their own hands – and could even make a mistake.
I have chosen these examples deliberately, because here the term “in one’s own hand” is used quite regularly not for the inferior team, but, at the moment, for the superior team. You negated that, however. That was the point, not that you are of course right when you say that teams that need help to achieve success no longer have it in their own hands. But if I now assume that Bayern will play against Leipzig under laboratory conditions, in the best place, with a full squad and, as far as this is measurable, highly motivated players on both sides, then Bayern, viewed quite soberly, have a quality advantage over Leipzig. If you put him on the field, then you win the game and, as you say, the championship is in your own hands. If Leipzig wins, the Bavarians have underperformed in at least one area, thus giving up their advantage. Nagelsmann has been speculating for a long time in public a lá “If Bavaria makes a mistake, you have to be there!”. That contradicts the thesis you put forward in the first post. “In your own hands” is definitely a theoretical-technical term, which, contrary to your claim, can only logically refer to the owner of some kind of advantage, and Leipzig does not (yet) have that. On the contrary: you still have the difficult game against your direct competitor ahead of you. Naturally, if you see differently in Leipzig in order to motivate yourself within the club, it contradicts the meaning of the phrase.
If, as you say, this idiom could only be applied to teams that are inferior in the table, because teams that are superior in the table make the phrase unnecessary per se, then that would be incoherent in itself. Either you argue with the theoretical-technical sense behind this idiom that you mentioned, or with the conscious decision of the speaker / writer not to use this theoretical-technical sense if it is obvious. Both are not possible, however.
I’m sorry, I completely misunderstood your post. Of course you are absolutely right! (From the first word “yes and no” I concluded a completely different conclusion that had nothing to do with the actual statement of your contribution – the fault for this misunderstanding lies solely with me!)
Thanks for the effort of quoting the contributions!
My claim that the term is mostly used for “inferior” teams is of course not true – it is used more often, especially in relegation battles but also in the battle for international positions.